#95: She Built an MTSS System That Actually Works – Here’s how with Joan Schumann
When MTSS Feels Like Just Another Acronym
If you’ve ever felt like MTSS is just another district initiative you should be doing—but you’re not sure where to start—you’re not alone.
In this episode, we talk with Dr. Joan Schumann, a teacher, school leader, and now founder of the International MTSS Association, who has seen it all. From scattered interventions and overworked teams to true system-wide alignment, she’s built an MTSS framework that actually gets results.
But it didn’t happen overnight. It started with one mindset shift: stop looking at student issues in isolation—and start looking at the system that’s producing them.
What Most Schools Get Wrong About MTSS
Most schools jump straight into Tier 2 and Tier 3 interventions the moment they see red flags in the data. But Joan challenges us to pause and ask:
“Is this really a student issue… or a Tier 1 issue?”
Here’s the truth: You can’t intervene your way out of a broken Tier 1.
Joan shares that the most powerful MTSS systems start with a brutally honest look at core instruction. Are 75% of your students making benchmark without additional support? If not, Tier 2 won’t fix it—Tier 1 needs attention.
And that shift—from student blame to system ownership—is where the magic starts.
The Step-by-Step Blueprint for Implementing MTSS
If your team is ready to move from reactive to responsive, here’s what Joan recommends:
Step 1: Strengthen Tier 1 First
- Use universal screening data (not teacher referrals) to spot trends.
- Don’t jump to names—look at the system-wide percentages first.
- If fewer than 75% are meeting benchmarks, it’s a Tier 1 problem.
Step 2: Group Your Data Before Grouping Your Kids
- Use PLCs to analyze the why behind the numbers.
- Look for grade-level trends (e.g., weak in vocabulary? phonemic awareness?).
- Don’t make assumptions—let the data guide instruction.
Step 3: Only Problem-Solve Individual Kids After Checking the System
- Before calling a Tier 2 meeting, ask: How are the other kids in this group doing?
- If everyone is flatlining, it’s not the kid—it’s the intervention.
Step 4: Train Interventionists Like They Matter (Because They Do)
- Paras, volunteers, even peer tutors can succeed if they’re trained and supported.
- Use programs backed by the National Center for Intensive Intervention.
- Ongoing coaching is 3x more effective than one-time PD.
Step 5: Build a Safe Culture Around the Data
- Teachers need to feel safe being honest about what’s not working.
- Leaders should model vulnerability: “Here’s what I’m doing to support this shift.”
- Create space to look at both data and implementation fidelity.
In This Episode, You’ll Discover:
- Why Tier 2 interventions often fail—and what to do instead.
- The biggest mistake teams make when reviewing student data.
- How to know when it’s a student issue vs. a system issue.
- The 75/75 Rule every school team should follow.
- How to support untrained interventionists without burning them out.
Bringing It All Together
MTSS isn’t just about meetings, graphs, or spreadsheets. It’s about people—teachers, leaders, and kids—working together inside a system that makes sense.
Joan’s story reminds us that it’s possible to implement MTSS in a way that’s effective, sustainable, and rooted in real collaboration. But it starts by shifting our focus from what’s wrong with this student to what’s missing from this system.
You don’t have to build it alone—but you do have to start.
Want More Support? Join The Science of Reading Formula
If you’re ready to align your reading instruction with what actually works—both in Tier 1 and beyond—The Science of Reading Formula is here to help.
Inside, you’ll learn brain-based, science-backed strategies that support MTSS from the ground up—starting with The Reading Roadmap, our 4-week bootcamp that gets your Tier 1 right from the start.
🎯 Join The Science of Reading Formula here
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